"Flashback" Rewatch Reaction
Nov. 3rd, 2010 09:28 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
2corbiesI now present an exceedingly tardy rewatch reaction post for Flashback, which we watched on 9/19/2010 (late>=never). This was the last episode of Season 2, and the last episode where Vecchio was our primary Ray. glitteryv long ago posted the reaction to the rewatch of "Burning Down the House" from the same date.
This is a very emotional time for all us fangirls. Asglitteryv reminds us, we're in the last leg of the rewatch-- the whole thing will be finished in December. But, after that, the rewatch crew is planning to get tackle some of the other C6D stuff, starting with Slings and Arrows. So stay tuned!
As usual, most of the reaction stuff here is fairly light and fluffy (though these two episode have triggered more introspection than most, I think.) if you're looking for serious analysis, we recommend you skip on over to Truepenny's excellent blog, which has a lot to say about the change-of-Ray, and certainly informed our own conversation.
akamine_chan couldn't be there, so glitteryv did the honors as cat-herder in chief rewatch captain this week.
On saying goodbye to Vecchio and finishing S1-2
We were all sad to see Vecchio go.cyberducks took it hardest. Lotte and I both felt we'd gained a better appreciation for him thanks to the rewatch. helens78 offered him snuggles and the certain knowledge that we'd be seeing him again soon.
On the coming of RayK and the beginning of S3-4
We were also uniformly excited by the beginning of season 3.thursdaynext_27 and glitteryv shared a moment of squee. magelight5 "loves Ray V dearly, but [she is] unabashedly a Ray K fangirl." Luce and I both agreed that, while we like Seasons 3-4 best, seasons 1-2 are really necessary to appreciate them. One of my friends outside the rewatch is of the opinion that S3-4 is really RayK's plot arc, and that Fraser's was largely completed in S1-2. We don't get much more new characterization of Fraser from this point forward. Cyberducks is terribly conflicted, saying: " I kinda like the writing better in the first two seasons and some of the Fraser characterisation and some of the best eps are in the first two seasons - but the last seasons have RayK and their partnership which I also love."
On the structure of the episode:
On the other hand, most of us really dislike the structure of the episode.glitteryv goes as far as to say: "That's what I don't like this [episode] while feeling relieved that it's not the series finale. That would have been FATAL." cyberducks and thursdaynext_27 note that it really seems like a throwaway episode, strung together on a budget after CBS had made the decision to cancel the series. The heist subplot notwithstanding, its basically just a clip show. Though, helens78 observes, there real problems with the characterization of amnesiac!fraser (see below). It's nice to see some of the clips from old episodes. The ones of the Riv, of Dief and Victoria (angst!!) were glitteryv's favorite. But we also could have done with some more clips from the better shot shows, like "Chicago Holliday," and helens78 points out the ridiculousness of actually having clips from this very show towards the end. The endcredits with all the laughs and bloopers were excellent, however, and made us sad to see Vecchio go.
On the Improbability of the plot:
The heist subplot (did it actually think it was the main plot?) was pretty ridiculous.glitteryv thinks the thieves are terribly obvious, though I'm sad to note that nobody would be that nice to a woman in a burkah these days. I can't figure why they picked this stupid heist thing as the frame plot, though as Luce points out, it is what gets us the amnesiac!Fraser, which provides most of the episode’s interest. thursdaynext_27 and cyberducks do appreciate the wife and the girlfriends teaming up on the douche bag banker, but podfic_lover can't figure out why four such attractive women would have been with him in the first place! All in all, we don't feel like the heist is a strong enough plot to carry it's part of the episode.
On clothes and fashion:
One of the things about this being Vecchio's last major episode is that we get a recap of his wardrobe!helens78 is amused by his gigantic 90s suits from S1, and glitteryv misses the old tacky Vecchio. thursdaynext_27 notably does not miss Vecchio's S1 look, being quite partial to his wardrobe in S2. We generally agree that, however endearing some of us might have found the horrible wardrobe of season 1, Vecchio was a much better dresser in Season 2. His hair was also better. As thursdaynext_27 points out, it looks pretty odd, longer than we're used to and all slicked back, in the first few episodes. Moving away from Vecchio's clothes, we also get to see a fair number of clips of Fraser's old brown uniform, which we will otherwise never see again (sadly, however, we don't get any clips from the one episode where he wears the blue uniform, which is, I understand, what real Mounties actually wear to work. . .)
On Amnesiac!Fraser
thursdaynext_27 and helens78 both instantly notice Amnesiac!Frase's use of profanity-- he says "hell" in two separate sentances. how_obscure notes, however, that he still says "Oh dear." glitteryv thinks "that amnesiac!Fraser is pure Paul Gross. The Who the hell am I and his facial expression, etc." Lotte agrees. luzula also agrees, but it’s part of why she dislikes the episode: “it's like seeing the actor behind the character, which I always hate.“ luzula is also the one who notices that "It's almost like Fraser turns more American when he's having amnesia. . . .maybe it's like he's taking over Ray's personality in some way?" how_obscure wonders if it’s “possible that he's forgotten all of the experiences that helped form his personality?” glitteryv also finds it more than a little "chilling to see the Fraser we know vanished." I agree-- I think that “when he's not being Fraser he's being Anti-Fraser-- all his own worst inclinations.”
cyberducks introduces the idea that " amnesiac!Fraser proves that all his Fraserisms are a choice," and glitteryv points out that "A lot about Fraser is choice vs. duty." They are entirely in agreement with truepenny’s excellent analysis of this episode.
So, all in all, there’s a huge contrast between our Usual Fraser and amnesiac!Fraser.helens78 notes that “He's so *stiff* [in the pilot], like everything he's saying is still covered with grief -- Fraser, I mean. It's such a departure from S2 Fraser.” I notice how “even Fraser thinks Fraser's crazy”-- amnesiac!Fraser can’t believe he jumped onto a moving van.
There are definitely more than a few kinky undertones (and overtones-- the finale, anyone?) to this episode.helens78, glitteryv and cyberducks all comment on the irony Fraser wondering if he’s “being punished” by his living situation. It definitely seems to hint at a masochistic streak in the character and, of course, next season, he’ll be living in his office-- and even worse “punishment.” And his desk has so many erasers! helens78 and cyberducks both think it hints at a rubber fetish. Me, I think the guy’s just OCD. Must be prepared for any mistakes he might make!
glitteryv notes that “the fact that Fraser doesn't talk to Dief adds a little bit of doubt to the idea that he can have conversations with him.” spuffyduds42 feels that “he just doesn't KNOW, luce. . . he's gotta BELIEVE”
As Lotte points out, it’s also terribly ironic that the first thing amnesiac!Fraser remembers is seeing his dead father. I agree, especially since its something Ray doesn’t know about. And he also seems to feel *something* from Thatcher-- again, something that Ray plays off as not being true. Though, of course, ashelens78 notes, even amnesiac!fraser doesn’t really pick up on Thatcher's hints, but he did pick up on Rhonda flirting with him...” I sort of think it’s because “amnesiac Fraser seems to have a much more conventional sense of male/female relations.”
Plot Bunnies:
Frompodfic_lover: How did RayV get this picture to create the postcard later on?
Fromglitteryv: Fraser NEVER recovers from his amnesia. At least not completely. The Ray swicheroo happens and he remains a Mountie.
Also fromglitteryv: Thatcher takes advantage of amnesiac!Fraser. Kinda dub-connish?
Fromendcredits: Christina! Rrrrr. I love her! Even if she did shoot Frase in the hat,” to which glitteryv adds: I still say she should have teamed up with Victoria. It woudl have been epic.. . . Or maybe some super-villaness gang: Christina, Tammy and Victoria team up.
Fromhelens78: I am trying to figure out why I have never thought of pairing Victoria with Maggie before. . . Victoria starts off trying to use Maggie to get to Fraser, but ends up falling for her. But of course, with Victoria, falling for someone doesn't mean she's gonna reform...
Frompodfic_lover: Fraser has multiple personalities in him, some able to drive, some not;...
To which Lotte adds: and some can play poker, some not
podfic_lover thinks they might all be a bunch of Mounties, and how_obscure thinks: Maybe this is his one non-Mountie personality showing up?
So that’s it for the Flashback reaction post. Absurdly late, but not never-- we will at least have a complete set. If you haven’t had a chance to join us for the rewatch yet, please feel free to drop by: 2pm every Sunday on Skype. Check out the getting-to-know-you meme onakamine_chan’s journal (on LJ or DW), as well as her excellent list of all posts related to the rewatch. And we hope to see you there!
glitteryv long ago posted the reaction to the rewatch of "Burning Down the House" from the same date.This is a very emotional time for all us fangirls. As
glitteryv reminds us, we're in the last leg of the rewatch-- the whole thing will be finished in December. But, after that, the rewatch crew is planning to get tackle some of the other C6D stuff, starting with Slings and Arrows. So stay tuned!As usual, most of the reaction stuff here is fairly light and fluffy (though these two episode have triggered more introspection than most, I think.) if you're looking for serious analysis, we recommend you skip on over to Truepenny's excellent blog, which has a lot to say about the change-of-Ray, and certainly informed our own conversation.
akamine_chan couldn't be there, so glitteryv did the honors as On saying goodbye to Vecchio and finishing S1-2
We were all sad to see Vecchio go.
cyberducks took it hardest. Lotte and I both felt we'd gained a better appreciation for him thanks to the rewatch. helens78 offered him snuggles and the certain knowledge that we'd be seeing him again soon.On the coming of RayK and the beginning of S3-4
We were also uniformly excited by the beginning of season 3.
thursdaynext_27 and glitteryv shared a moment of squee. magelight5 "loves Ray V dearly, but [she is] unabashedly a Ray K fangirl." Luce and I both agreed that, while we like Seasons 3-4 best, seasons 1-2 are really necessary to appreciate them. One of my friends outside the rewatch is of the opinion that S3-4 is really RayK's plot arc, and that Fraser's was largely completed in S1-2. We don't get much more new characterization of Fraser from this point forward. Cyberducks is terribly conflicted, saying: " I kinda like the writing better in the first two seasons and some of the Fraser characterisation and some of the best eps are in the first two seasons - but the last seasons have RayK and their partnership which I also love."On the structure of the episode:
On the other hand, most of us really dislike the structure of the episode.
glitteryv goes as far as to say: "That's what I don't like this [episode] while feeling relieved that it's not the series finale. That would have been FATAL." cyberducks and thursdaynext_27 note that it really seems like a throwaway episode, strung together on a budget after CBS had made the decision to cancel the series. The heist subplot notwithstanding, its basically just a clip show. Though, helens78 observes, there real problems with the characterization of amnesiac!fraser (see below). It's nice to see some of the clips from old episodes. The ones of the Riv, of Dief and Victoria (angst!!) were glitteryv's favorite. But we also could have done with some more clips from the better shot shows, like "Chicago Holliday," and helens78 points out the ridiculousness of actually having clips from this very show towards the end. The endcredits with all the laughs and bloopers were excellent, however, and made us sad to see Vecchio go.On the Improbability of the plot:
The heist subplot (did it actually think it was the main plot?) was pretty ridiculous.
glitteryv thinks the thieves are terribly obvious, though I'm sad to note that nobody would be that nice to a woman in a burkah these days. I can't figure why they picked this stupid heist thing as the frame plot, though as Luce points out, it is what gets us the amnesiac!Fraser, which provides most of the episode’s interest. thursdaynext_27 and cyberducks do appreciate the wife and the girlfriends teaming up on the douche bag banker, but podfic_lover can't figure out why four such attractive women would have been with him in the first place! All in all, we don't feel like the heist is a strong enough plot to carry it's part of the episode.On clothes and fashion:
One of the things about this being Vecchio's last major episode is that we get a recap of his wardrobe!
helens78 is amused by his gigantic 90s suits from S1, and glitteryv misses the old tacky Vecchio. thursdaynext_27 notably does not miss Vecchio's S1 look, being quite partial to his wardrobe in S2. We generally agree that, however endearing some of us might have found the horrible wardrobe of season 1, Vecchio was a much better dresser in Season 2. His hair was also better. As thursdaynext_27 points out, it looks pretty odd, longer than we're used to and all slicked back, in the first few episodes. Moving away from Vecchio's clothes, we also get to see a fair number of clips of Fraser's old brown uniform, which we will otherwise never see again (sadly, however, we don't get any clips from the one episode where he wears the blue uniform, which is, I understand, what real Mounties actually wear to work. . .) On Amnesiac!Fraser
thursdaynext_27 and helens78 both instantly notice Amnesiac!Frase's use of profanity-- he says "hell" in two separate sentances. how_obscure notes, however, that he still says "Oh dear." glitteryv thinks "that amnesiac!Fraser is pure Paul Gross. The Who the hell am I and his facial expression, etc." Lotte agrees. luzula also agrees, but it’s part of why she dislikes the episode: “it's like seeing the actor behind the character, which I always hate.“ luzula is also the one who notices that "It's almost like Fraser turns more American when he's having amnesia. . . .maybe it's like he's taking over Ray's personality in some way?" how_obscure wonders if it’s “possible that he's forgotten all of the experiences that helped form his personality?” glitteryv also finds it more than a little "chilling to see the Fraser we know vanished." I agree-- I think that “when he's not being Fraser he's being Anti-Fraser-- all his own worst inclinations.”cyberducks introduces the idea that " amnesiac!Fraser proves that all his Fraserisms are a choice," and glitteryv points out that "A lot about Fraser is choice vs. duty." They are entirely in agreement with truepenny’s excellent analysis of this episode.So, all in all, there’s a huge contrast between our Usual Fraser and amnesiac!Fraser.
helens78 notes that “He's so *stiff* [in the pilot], like everything he's saying is still covered with grief -- Fraser, I mean. It's such a departure from S2 Fraser.” I notice how “even Fraser thinks Fraser's crazy”-- amnesiac!Fraser can’t believe he jumped onto a moving van. There are definitely more than a few kinky undertones (and overtones-- the finale, anyone?) to this episode.
helens78, glitteryv and cyberducks all comment on the irony Fraser wondering if he’s “being punished” by his living situation. It definitely seems to hint at a masochistic streak in the character and, of course, next season, he’ll be living in his office-- and even worse “punishment.” And his desk has so many erasers! helens78 and cyberducks both think it hints at a rubber fetish. Me, I think the guy’s just OCD. Must be prepared for any mistakes he might make!glitteryv notes that “the fact that Fraser doesn't talk to Dief adds a little bit of doubt to the idea that he can have conversations with him.” spuffyduds42 feels that “he just doesn't KNOW, luce. . . he's gotta BELIEVE”As Lotte points out, it’s also terribly ironic that the first thing amnesiac!Fraser remembers is seeing his dead father. I agree, especially since its something Ray doesn’t know about. And he also seems to feel *something* from Thatcher-- again, something that Ray plays off as not being true. Though, of course, as
helens78 notes, even amnesiac!fraser doesn’t really pick up on Thatcher's hints, but he did pick up on Rhonda flirting with him...” I sort of think it’s because “amnesiac Fraser seems to have a much more conventional sense of male/female relations.”Plot Bunnies:
From
podfic_lover: How did RayV get this picture to create the postcard later on?From
glitteryv: Fraser NEVER recovers from his amnesia. At least not completely. The Ray swicheroo happens and he remains a Mountie.Also from
glitteryv: Thatcher takes advantage of amnesiac!Fraser. Kinda dub-connish?From
endcredits: Christina! Rrrrr. I love her! Even if she did shoot Frase in the hat,” to which glitteryv adds: I still say she should have teamed up with Victoria. It woudl have been epic.. . . Or maybe some super-villaness gang: Christina, Tammy and Victoria team up.From
helens78: I am trying to figure out why I have never thought of pairing Victoria with Maggie before. . . Victoria starts off trying to use Maggie to get to Fraser, but ends up falling for her. But of course, with Victoria, falling for someone doesn't mean she's gonna reform...From
podfic_lover: Fraser has multiple personalities in him, some able to drive, some not;...To which Lotte adds: and some can play poker, some not
podfic_lover thinks they might all be a bunch of Mounties, and how_obscure thinks: Maybe this is his one non-Mountie personality showing up?So that’s it for the Flashback reaction post. Absurdly late, but not never-- we will at least have a complete set. If you haven’t had a chance to join us for the rewatch yet, please feel free to drop by: 2pm every Sunday on Skype. Check out the getting-to-know-you meme on
akamine_chan’s journal (on LJ or DW), as well as her excellent list of all posts related to the rewatch. And we hope to see you there!
no subject
Date: 2010-11-29 01:10 am (UTC)I think that parts of The Mountie aren't as simple as something that Fraser chooses to don--I think he's tamped parts of himself into boxes so he can't get at the things that Ray tries to remind him that humans have.
AmnesiaFraser doesn't 'remember' the boxes so their contents are a bit more apparent.